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bohdankudelya
29 / Male

Posts:111
Rank: Addict
Posted: July 04 2006 at 10:25 PM

  for those who believe in God, abortion and uthinasia r not right period.
 
   
Jan_na
28 / Female

Posts:1065
Rank: SuperGod
Posted: July 04 2006 at 10:40 PM

  erm...you can believe in god regardless of whether you strictly follow a set religion, but okay...
 
   
Jan_na
28 / Female

Posts:1065
Rank: SuperGod
Posted: July 04 2006 at 10:44 PM

 
  Quote: ilovevlad
  [quote=DarK_angeL]tough decisions....hard to say...

Abortion: a crime from my point of view...the poor child has no fault and he/she shouldn't lose his/her life....and the mother/parents have no right to take his/her life...yet, sometimes it's the best choice for both parents and children



Ur soft.

Abortion rocks - its not a child, its nothing at that point, and if you want you could always have more.


You cannot always have more children; it depends on how the procedure is done and how the mother reacts to it, sometimes having children after an abortion is impossible. However, I agree with Natusik, the choice should ultimately be that of the parents, and like Dark_Angel said, sometimes it is a circumstance in which abortion would be the best choice for both parent and child.

As for euthanasia, it's a difficult subject to simply discuss without being in such a situation. For the sake of discussion I suppose there are two sides to such an idea, the first being that one would want to stop the pain of a loved one are going through; there is however the subject of not being able to let go of a loved one, regardless of their pain, although a seemingly selfish view is still a completely understandable one. Sometimes letting go of the ones we love is too hard. If the decision is up to the actual patient, like mizzdyme said, then it should be acceptable, freedom of choice (however such a choice may be thoroughly radical for a person in severe pain to make). There are also the ethical issues behind such an act; is it morally acceptable to end one's life for them, and not allow natural causes to do so instead? Just points of view to ponder I suppose, but like I said...its difficult to think about what one would do in such a situation without actually being in it.

 
   
Vitali
30 / Male

Posts:317
Rank: Administrator
Posted: July 04 2006 at 10:54 PM

 
  Quote: Jan_na
 
There are also the ethical issues behind such an act; is it morally acceptable to end one's life for them, and not allow natural causes to do so instead?


It is natural causes though...you're not putting a gun to thier head. "Natutrally", a machine would not be breating for that person, so unhooking the machine is the "natural" thing to do. The only problem I can see with euthinasia is if the person cannot make a decision by him/herself, and family memebers are split as to what to do (i.e. Terri Schiavo). In that case, it's conservatives vs. liberals and a big freaking mess.

As for abortion, I'm pro-choice. I don't see abortion as murder, in fact, I don't believe in attactching strings to it either. If a woman feels that she's not ready to have a a baby, the baby should not be subjected to being born to a mother that doesn't want him. Neither should society be forced to take care of that baby. Don't try to apply those views to other subjects (I'm an active debater, so I know what the first thing another debater would say), this is my opinion on abortion. Take it or leave it.
 
   
bohdankudelya
29 / Male

Posts:111
Rank: Addict
Posted: July 05 2006 at 03:45 AM

 
  Quote: Jan_na
  erm...you can believe in god regardless of whether you strictly follow a set religion, but okay...


I think believing in god and not following a set religion is pointless. You have to base your idea of god to a sertain belief so that ur belief in god would be explianed to u, and u would understand god. Religion is besically this set of intrustions on how to live a good life, and u achieve it throught believing in these instructions which come from a sertain God. Without religion all u would have is an idea of a higher power and know nothing about it, which sounds pointless to me.

So what u said about abortion and uthinasia condradicts those belives, therefore, the right thing to do in any case is not to do either.
I know u said "but okay", it's just that i wanted to give u a different point of view.
 
   
Tinkerb1tch
30 / Female

Posts:1601
Rank: Moderator
Posted: July 06 2006 at 08:54 AM

 
  Quote: bohdankudelya
 
I think believing in god and not following a set religion is pointless. You have to base your idea of god to a sertain belief so that ur belief in god would be explianed to u, and u would understand god. Religion is besically this set of intrustions on how to live a good life, and u achieve it throught believing in these instructions which come from a sertain God. Without religion all u would have is an idea of a higher power and know nothing about it, which sounds pointless to me.

So what u said about abortion and uthinasia condradicts those belives, therefore, the right thing to do in any case is not to do either.
I know u said "but okay", it's just that i wanted to give u a different point of view.


I don't think many people understand God even if they are super religious... The idea of a higher power can't be explained becase theres no solid proof of it. Religion and laws are pretty similar though so in a way a non-religious person who believes in God can follows laws, not practice religion and for me it makes sense.
 
   
Tinkerb1tch
30 / Female

Posts:1601
Rank: Moderator
Posted: July 06 2006 at 08:55 AM

 
  Quote: Vitali
 
  Quote: Jan_na
 
There are also the ethical issues behind such an act; is it morally acceptable to end one's life for them, and not allow natural causes to do so instead?


It is natural causes though...you're not putting a gun to thier head. "Natutrally", a machine would not be breating for that person, so unhooking the machine is the "natural" thing to do. The only problem I can see with euthinasia is if the person cannot make a decision by him/herself, and family memebers are split as to what to do (i.e. Terri Schiavo). In that case, it's conservatives vs. liberals and a big freaking mess.

As for abortion, I'm pro-choice. I don't see abortion as murder, in fact, I don't believe in attactching strings to it either. If a woman feels that she's not ready to have a a baby, the baby should not be subjected to being born to a mother that doesn't want him. Neither should society be forced to take care of that baby. Don't try to apply those views to other subjects (I'm an active debater, so I know what the first thing another debater would say), this is my opinion on abortion. Take it or leave it.


AHHAHAAH you just pulled something I would with the whole "natural" thing! Great minds think a like!
 
   
bohdankudelya
29 / Male

Posts:111
Rank: Addict
Posted: July 06 2006 at 06:52 PM

 
  Quote: Tinkerb1tch
 
  Quote: Vitali
 
  Quote: Jan_na
 
There are also the ethical issues behind such an act; is it morally acceptable to end one's life for them, and not allow natural causes to do so instead?


It is natural causes though...you're not putting a gun to thier head. "Natutrally", a machine would not be breating for that person, so unhooking the machine is the "natural" thing to do. The only problem I can see with euthinasia is if the person cannot make a decision by him/herself, and family memebers are split as to what to do (i.e. Terri Schiavo). In that case, it's conservatives vs. liberals and a big freaking mess.

As for abortion, I'm pro-choice. I don't see abortion as murder, in fact, I don't believe in attactching strings to it either. If a woman feels that she's not ready to have a a baby, the baby should not be subjected to being born to a mother that doesn't want him. Neither should society be forced to take care of that baby. Don't try to apply those views to other subjects (I'm an active debater, so I know what the first thing another debater would say), this is my opinion on abortion. Take it or leave it.


AHHAHAAH you just pulled something I would with the whole "natural" thing! Great minds think a like!


Euthanasia isn't just "pulling the plug", but it's also giving drugs to a human person to kill him/her. So, what u said definately makes sense, but it only applies to just one method of euthanasia. I dont think u know what euthinasia means, u think that it's only pulling the plug. Other methods include giving drugs to ppl who don't depend on machines but live with a physical disability, this is still called physician assisted suicide.
 
   
soviet_soldie
31 / Female

Posts:1278
Rank: SuperGod
Posted: July 06 2006 at 07:20 PM

 
 
   
bohdankudelya
29 / Male

Posts:111
Rank: Addict
Posted: July 06 2006 at 07:20 PM

 
  Quote: Tinkerb1tch
 
  Quote: bohdankudelya
 
I think believing in god and not following a set religion is pointless. You have to base your idea of god to a sertain belief so that ur belief in god would be explianed to u, and u would understand god. Religion is besically this set of intrustions on how to live a good life, and u achieve it throught believing in these instructions which come from a sertain God. Without religion all u would have is an idea of a higher power and know nothing about it, which sounds pointless to me.

So what u said about abortion and uthinasia condradicts those belives, therefore, the right thing to do in any case is not to do either.
I know u said "but okay", it's just that i wanted to give u a different point of view.



I don't think many people understand God even if they are super religious... The idea of a higher power can't be explained becase theres no solid proof of it. Religion and laws are pretty similar though so in a way a non-religious person who believes in God can follows laws, not practice religion and for me it makes sense.


Yes it can be explained. According to the Bible, humans, animals, and everything else in the universe were created by God. The idea that we simply materialized out of nothing is a logical and scientifin impossibility. Check this out. The first law of thermodynamics tells us that matter can neither be created nor destroyed by natural causes. That's a big problem for an evolutionist. If only "natural causes" are involved, how did nothing turn into something? Also, how did that something develop intelligance, a definite personality, morality, and spirituality? By chance? Impossible! So, what does this all add up to? Three words: God did it.
 
   
Vitali
30 / Male

Posts:317
Rank: Administrator
Posted: July 07 2006 at 12:32 PM

  "It's complicated, therefore it's God"....you have no idea how much I love destrying that argument. I believe in God by the way, but I don't think that's the right way to explain it.

Last edited by Vitali on July 07, 2006 a 12:33 PM
 
   
bohdankudelya
29 / Male

Posts:111
Rank: Addict
Posted: July 07 2006 at 06:48 PM

 
  Quote: Vitali
  "It's complicated, therefore it's God"....you have no idea how much I love destrying that argument. I believe in God by the way, but I don't think that's the right way to explain it.<br><br><font size = "-4">Last edited by Vitali on July 07, 2006 a 12:33 PM</font>


U didnt even say anything other than that my explanation is bad. Plus, I think my explanation will convince any rational person... Sorry if I sound a little harsh but I don't think u made any sence at all there. I didnt just say "It's complicated, therefore it's God", I said alot more than that. U missed out on the first half n got only the last sentance or two of the explanation.

I said, matter cannot b created by natural causes which is a big problem for evolutionists.
But, even evolutionists admit that their beliefes involve as much faith and speculation, if not more, as the creationists because they know that matter cannot b created by natural forces.
The Bible gives us one core fact about the origin of humanity: God created us in his own image.
 
   
Tinkerb1tch
30 / Female

Posts:1601
Rank: Moderator
Posted: July 09 2006 at 01:34 AM

 
  Quote: bohdankudelya
 
Euthanasia isn't just "pulling the plug", but it's also giving drugs to a human person to kill him/her. So, what u said definately makes sense, but it only applies to just one method of euthanasia. I dont think u know what euthinasia means, u think that it's only pulling the plug. Other methods include giving drugs to ppl who don't depend on machines but live with a physical disability, this is still called physician assisted suicide.


Very true. The point I was trying to get at when I made this thread is I think euthanasia can be a very good thing.

ITs hard to explain to someone whos never had to mske s decision like that so I cant expect everyone to understand but when someone gets to a certain point and they're stuggling with every breath and they've lost so much weight you can actually see the form of their bone structure you just don't want to watch them suffer anymore.
 
   
shawnka
27 / Female

Posts:61
Rank: Senior
Posted: July 21 2006 at 12:33 AM

  i dont really know what my total view is on abortion but i feel that it is completely right for a girl to get an abortion if she is under age and cannot handle a child. it is better to do that then waiting 9 months and then giving it away to a foster home. it is heartbreaking to give away ur child. or to not even see it. it is much better for a girl to jus kill it before it becomes a human. in the first couple weeks it is not a human yet so technically it isnt murder. so i find it perfectly ok.
 
   
xxbeautiful7
25 / Female

Posts:1003
Rank: SuperGod
Posted: July 26 2006 at 11:02 PM

  I don't think there is anything wrong with abortion...its not even a child. you're killing a cell. though if its a first child the woman is aborting, there is a big chance she won't get pregnant again.
 
   
Tinkerb1tch
30 / Female

Posts:1601
Rank: Moderator
Posted: July 29 2006 at 11:19 PM

 
  Quote: xxbeautiful7
  I don't think there is anything wrong with abortion...its not even a child. you're killing a cell. though if its a first child the woman is aborting, there is a big chance she won't get pregnant again.


I don't think it makes a difference whether its the first or the fifth child shes aborting she will have trouble getting pregnant again.

Last edited by Tinkerb1tch on July 30, 2006 a 1:44 PM
 
   
sekceenikki10
29 / Female

Posts:236
Rank: God
Posted: August 31 2006 at 01:46 AM

  abortion- i guess it kind of depends where u r in ur life and if u can handle havin a child at that point..im against it..a lot of ppl say its nothing but its still goin to be sumthing that YOU created..i guess i wouldnt want to live my life knowing that i killed a child...
Euthanasia- as most ppl have been sayin, if the animal is suffering and is in a lot of pain..then yeh, euthanise the poor thing..i wouldnt want to see it suffer every day :( thats just torture..
but good forum by the way, its a topic that many ppl have many different views on
 
   
Karinka
41 / Female

Posts:773
Rank: God
Posted: October 20 2006 at 03:33 PM

 
  Quote: bohdankudelya
 
  Quote: Vitali
  "It's complicated, therefore it's God"....you have no idea how much I love destrying that argument. I believe in God by the way, but I don't think that's the right way to explain it.<br><br><font size = "-4">Last edited by Vitali on July 07, 2006 a 12:33 PM</font>


U didnt even say anything other than that my explanation is bad. Plus, I think my explanation will convince any rational person... Sorry if I sound a little harsh but I don't think u made any sence at all there. I didnt just say "It's complicated, therefore it's God", I said alot more than that. U missed out on the first half n got only the last sentance or two of the explanation.

I said, matter cannot b created by natural causes which is a big problem for evolutionists.
But, even evolutionists admit that their beliefes involve as much faith and speculation, if not more, as the creationists because they know that matter cannot b created by natural forces.
The Bible gives us one core fact about the origin of humanity: God created us in his own image.


k i believe in god too, but dont take everything that the bible says literally.. the creation story of genesis was written what like 2 thousand yrs ago when they thought the world is flat.. humans weren't just magically created by God, we evolved from monkeys ...and some are still in the process of evolving lol
 
   
Karinka
41 / Female

Posts:773
Rank: God
Posted: October 20 2006 at 03:48 PM

  and for adoption: i think that the woman has the complete right to decide whether she wants to have the child or not depending on her circumstances: ie: rape/incest may have occured, too young/immature, financially/emotionally not ready to have a child..
the woman is taking full responsibility for the risk that abortion can bring. and out of all the women that have abortions, only about 0.5% cannot have children afterwards, and they are usually the ones that went to an uncertified clinic and got infections.

euthinasia: i think people have the right to choose how they want to die - its their life... if they are terminally ill and they suffer just from breathing, or they know that they dont have long to live - i think it should be their choice to decide on PAS, or a very close person to them that knows what they would want, if they cannot speak for themselves...
 
   
Nick
28 / Male

Posts:637
Rank: God
Posted: October 20 2006 at 04:57 PM

  i did not do it *rolls eyes*
 
 
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